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Tim - Thank you for that - to some extent I do understand but  what I do not understand is what has happened between the 18th December and  the re-lauch of the forum this week that changes the way the forum is run. I know that there has been a lot of arguments in the past - some were childish but some were very real points that people in the trade are passionate about. It does seem that now, more than ever, the Licensees in the UK need a place to air their voices truthfully and whilst I agree that use of bad language etc must not be tolerated, it does seem to me that the more the licensees try to unite and discuss the very real problems that face them, the more they are stifled. This must just add to their frustrations and very real worries about their futures, and whilst it is quite possible that some Pub Companies are trying to help their tenants, I fear that many hard working people, with mouths to feed and bills to pay are suffereing with sleepless nights and very real worries for their future. Is it not a wonder that they are getting angry? No-one likes to feel like a ping-pong ball being hit from each side - Landlord on one side and HMG on the other.Both sides seem to want to wallop them as much as that can until finally the ball explodes or lies dented to be chucked in the bin. If they can't have a voice on here - then where can they go???? Maybe a reality TV show could be made, where the director of a Pub Company would agree to go in to one of his company owned pubs for two weeks and run it, Meantime, the licensee of that pub could perhaps take a look at what the Big Cheeses are up against????? Put it to them, one of them may just have the round things to pull it off and show his "customers" that he really does care about them!! Declan - Good point. Loraine.

Hang on a cotton-picking minute here... Am I wrong in thinking that HMG are now targetting alcohol and its dangers both active and passive? Are they not on the brink of  "protecting" children from  the harms of the evil fluid?  Do they not want to ban advertising of  all things amber nectary or wigdety so that the little darlings never get to set their eyes on anything stronger than a banana milkshake?? Seems that Orchid may be pandering to the wrong audience here - what happens when Big Brother sends in undercover Social Services teams to catch women who are over the limit in charge of their offspring?  Oh no - sorry - I suppose it will be down to the licensees to make sure that the women drink sodas and the kids are guided blindfold through the pub to the softplay area!! Boy - am I glad I am out of the UK now.

Then ignore it Jon. I would imagine Bob will be only to happy to receive your total ignorance.

We're back - we're knackered - see you tomorrow.   Thanks for your support guys but we have a bad case of "Journalistitis" at the moment. Bob will catch up whenhe gets back to his home ground tomorrow!!   Goodnight - God Bless Bob and Loraine.      

Boy have we digressed here!  If we can first get back to Bill Dollan - He did not want to register on the MA as he is not a licensee. However, he did send me an email asking that I post it for him. If anyone would like to check with Bill that he did, in fact, write the following statement, you can email him via the Big Debate. He is listed as "Dollan" :- I have no problem with Bob posting my F2C letter on this site, it was written from the heart as this ban seriously affects the social life of my wife and I. To anyone who supports the ban I would say, please give a thought to the social consequences of your enthusiasm for a very severe piece of legislation.   Alternatives are available to satisfy both your need to avoid ETS and mine to have a reasonable social life.   Bill Dollan